As I was pulling the engine out of my MC5 400 today, I noticed that the shifter shaft is bent backwards a few degrees more than normal. To swap one out, which I don't have one yet, do I need to split the cases?
Britt Boyette
76 400 MC5 (project)
77 250 MC5 (uberproject)
77 Husky WR250
75 Can Am 125
76 RM370
77 Yamaha TT500D
83 YZ250 (future flat tracker)
06 KX450f
09 Kawasaki Versys
Too much of a good thing? I think NOT!
Yes you have to split the cases. If not bent to bad you can heat it up and straighten it. Later Gary
Yippee, my quick turnaround bike just turned into a long term project. Time to start searching around on eBay.
Britt Boyette
76 400 MC5 (project)
77 Husky WR250
76 RM370
83 YZ250
06 KX450f flat tracker
09 Kawasaki Versys
70 Suzuki TS250
Too much of a good thing? I think NOT!
It is not as bad as all of that... If you have the part, it can be done in about 4 hours. If you need help give Big Mac a call, he lives near you. He and I swapped out one on one of my bikes one afternoon.. thanks again Mac..
Thom Green,Still crazy after all these years!
76' 250 MC5 (orginal owner)
74'250 hare scrambler (project)
74' 1/2 440 maico
78' 440 maico
72' cr125 Husky (project)
74' TM125 suzuki
93' RMx 250 suzuki
I still need to find a shaft and order a gasket set from Al.
Britt Boyette
76 400 MC5 (project)
77 Husky WR250
76 RM370
83 YZ250
06 KX450f flat tracker
09 Kawasaki Versys
70 Suzuki TS250
Too much of a good thing? I think NOT!
I have a shifter shaft. Email me @
[email protected] Later Gary
I found one locally today but it looks like I still need a couple of other parts. It looks like a broken chain at some point broke the ears off the rear engine mount spacer and boogered up the 12mm bolt. So the parts search continues...
Britt Boyette
76 400 MC5 (project)
77 Husky WR250
76 RM370
83 YZ250
06 KX450f flat tracker
09 Kawasaki Versys
70 Suzuki TS250
Too much of a good thing? I think NOT!
Britt,
The rear engine mount spacer changed somewhere around 77-78 to one with long ears that mounted a roller, which was not previously used, but due to the increased travel, a roller was necessitated. The problem however, was the roller only lasted a couple days of enduro riding until the bushing wore out from mud and sand, unless you find a good sealed bearing unit to substitute that will last. I don't think originally a 76 would even have the ears or roller to begin with. Someone here may know more, since I am not home where I have access to any Penton/KTM shop manuals. I generally only use the roller on my later bikes, and just smooth the ears with a die grinder and sanding tool to guide the chain on the earlier bikes. Mike
Michael R. Winter
I enjoy rebuilding and appreciating Pentons!
1974 250 HS Pentons-1980 KTM 175-400'S
75 Can Am 175 TNT & 77 250 Black Widow
1976-78 RM & 77-79 PE Suzuki's
74 CR250M 07 CR125R & CR150R
It's a 76 so do you think I could just use a spacer and be alright?
Britt Boyette
76 400 MC5 (project)
77 Husky WR250
76 RM370
83 YZ250
06 KX450f flat tracker
09 Kawasaki Versys
70 Suzuki TS250
Too much of a good thing? I think NOT!
I would ask Gary Roach, since he is more involded with the racing side of things, but just for moderate use on the shorter travel bikes, it's more for reducing chain wear to the swingarm. Mike
Michael R. Winter
I enjoy rebuilding and appreciating Pentons!
1974 250 HS Pentons-1980 KTM 175-400'S
75 Can Am 175 TNT & 77 250 Black Widow
1976-78 RM & 77-79 PE Suzuki's
74 CR250M 07 CR125R & CR150R
I didn't realize that there had been a change there. my 76 has the same spacer as the earlier motors. the only guide was this metal strap on top of the swing arm but that always got a big chewed up, after I bent the stock swing arm, I replaced it with a 77 swing arm and it had a bracket on top that allowed you to put a plastic rub block in there, that is what is on there now... I have never seen any kind of roller and I do not remember that on my 78 when I had that bike.. so I guess I am a bit confussed, can some show me a picture? and I am wondering if it can be retrofitted.
Thom Green,Still crazy after all these years!
76' 250 MC5 (orginal owner)
74'250 hare scrambler (project)
74' 1/2 440 maico
78' 440 maico
72' cr125 Husky (project)
74' TM125 suzuki
93' RMx 250 suzuki
The roller bracket is actually the spacer that the rear engine mount bolt goes through on the right hand side of the engine directly behind the coutershaft sprocket. The early version had no "legs" and was merely a spacer which also serves as a protector to guard against the engine mount bolt being sawed into by the chain and also protects the swingarm to some extent. The later version has "legs" that protrude downward with holes that mounted a roller undeneath the spacer that the chain rode on and helped hold the chain up when it went slack due to the movement of the swingarm. Often it prohibited the use of o-ring 530 chain because it wasn't wide enough to accomodate the wider o-ring chain. I am working away from home until later this week, or I would post a pic. It is stock on my 78 MC5, and may have been used on some 77's. I actualy got a replacement spacer with roller from Al back in 2006 before the Reunion Ride, but the roller was junk after the ride, from mud and sand. Mike
Michael R. Winter
I enjoy rebuilding and appreciating Pentons!
1974 250 HS Pentons-1980 KTM 175-400'S
75 Can Am 175 TNT & 77 250 Black Widow
1976-78 RM & 77-79 PE Suzuki's
74 CR250M 07 CR125R & CR150R
MSR makes a modern roller that will work in that engine bracket and it has sealed bearings and will last almost indefinitely.
Larry P
This bike actually has what appears to be an aftermarket chain tensioner that bolts on back towards the brake link. The roller is huge too.
Britt Boyette
76 400 MC5 (project)
77 Husky WR250
76 RM370
83 YZ250
06 KX450f flat tracker
09 Kawasaki Versys
70 Suzuki TS250
Too much of a good thing? I think NOT!
Thanks for the info, that would be a cool addition..
Thom Green,Still crazy after all these years!
76' 250 MC5 (orginal owner)
74'250 hare scrambler (project)
74' 1/2 440 maico
78' 440 maico
72' cr125 Husky (project)
74' TM125 suzuki
93' RMx 250 suzuki
I just got home and looked it up in my Penton chassis and engine manuals and the spacer IS pictured in the 1977 MC5 chassis manual with the roller on the frame page in the lower left hand of the page. It is NOT used in the 77 GS6 chassis manual with the roller, only the spacer is shown without a roller in the center of the frame page. In the 76 manuals, the spacer is shown in the engine manual only, on the crankcase diagram page without a roller, and not even shown in the 76 frame manuals. Mike
Michael R. Winter
I enjoy rebuilding and appreciating Pentons!
1974 250 HS Pentons-1980 KTM 175-400'S
75 Can Am 175 TNT & 77 250 Black Widow
1976-78 RM & 77-79 PE Suzuki's
74 CR250M 07 CR125R & CR150R
Here are pics of an early style spacer without the roller, a 77-80 spacer with provisions for a roller, but without the roller or hardware, and a pretty worn out roller, and what happens when the roller locks up. Mike
(http://i232.photobucket.com/albums/ee220/454MRW/KTM73-76and77-80Spacers.jpg)
Michael R. Winter
I enjoy rebuilding and appreciating Pentons!
1974 250 HS Pentons-1980 KTM 175-400'S
75 Can Am 175 TNT & 77 250 Black Widow
1976-78 RM & 77-79 PE Suzuki's
74 CR250M 07 CR125R & CR150R
Mine looks the one on the left only broke off at the ear.
Britt Boyette
76 400 MC5 (project)
77 Husky WR250
76 RM370
83 YZ250
06 KX450f flat tracker
09 Kawasaki Versys
70 Suzuki TS250
Too much of a good thing? I think NOT!
The ones with the legs for the roller are shaped the same as the first one, with the exception of the addition of the legs, but it is hard to tell that in the picture, because the 3 of them are tilted forward. Mike
Michael R. Winter
I enjoy rebuilding and appreciating Pentons!
1974 250 HS Pentons-1980 KTM 175-400'S
75 Can Am 175 TNT & 77 250 Black Widow
1976-78 RM & 77-79 PE Suzuki's
74 CR250M 07 CR125R & CR150R
my 78 did not have the spacer with the roller, that is interesting. thanks for the picture.
Thom Green,Still crazy after all these years!
76' 250 MC5 (orginal owner)
74'250 hare scrambler (project)
74' 1/2 440 maico
78' 440 maico
72' cr125 Husky (project)
74' TM125 suzuki
93' RMx 250 suzuki
They all look like the chain beats on them in the same spot. Were they considered a wear and replace item like a rubbing block?
Britt Boyette
76 400 MC5 (project)
77 Husky WR250
76 RM370
83 YZ250
06 KX450f flat tracker
09 Kawasaki Versys
70 Suzuki TS250
Too much of a good thing? I think NOT!
I just weld them back up, replate them and reuse them!