Does anyone take a blood thinner - warfarin - and still ride? I figure there are a few older folks out there who may be on a blood thinner.... so.. basically two months ago I suffered three TIAs (transient ischemic attacks or as some call them - mini strokes) and after tests were performed I was diagnosed with a atrial septal aneurysm and a PFO (patent foramen ovale - fancy words for saying I have a hole in my heart). Basically a clot formed in the heart and traveled to my brain. The cardio doctor put me on warfarin - and blood pressure medicine - to prevent clots and to get my blood pressure low as possible. My BP now is usually 110/60 or just a tad lower now. Basically what I am somewhat worried about - is that while on a blood thinner - since this drug is too prevent clots, thus lowering the blood's ability to coagulate - is the issue of crashing and suffering some sort of bleeding internally. Externally - cuts, bruises, etc... no big deal.... So.. leads me to ask - any of you take this drug and how have you handled the possible risk associated with it riding off-road?
Freddie Smith
Freddie,
Give me a call sometime or email me your # & I can call you.
[email protected] 740-819-4481
Freddie,
I have been on plavix since 1995 and still ride some. I would ride more if I didn't have to work 60+ hours a week. I too am worried about a major injury. I bleed like crazy with any little cut, and my skin is so thin that any small little bump or scrape causes major bruises. Cutting myself shaving is like major surgery. I figure it is worth the risks to have some enjoyment left in life.
Donny Smith
Paragould, AR
I personally do not have to take any kind of blood thinners but I do have a close friend who does and has not been on a bike for nearly a year, it is breaking his heart, any help with this would be greatly appreciated.
Thom Green,Still crazy after all these years!
76' 250 MC5 (orginal owner)
74'250 hare scrambler (project)
74' 1/2 440 maico
78' 440 maico
72' cr125 Husky (project)
93' RMx 250 suzuki
Quotequote:Originally posted by Randy Kirkbride
Freddie,
Give me a call sometime or email me your # & I can call you.
[email protected] 740-819-4481
Randy - thanks - I'll give you a call next week - when is the best time? Evenings? Afternoons? Mornings?
When you see 803-480-5662 pop up..that will be me.
Freddie
Quotequote:Originally posted by tomale
I personally do not have to take any kind of blood thinners but I do have a close friend who does and has not been on a bike for nearly a year, it is breaking his heart, any help with this would be greatly appreciated.
Thom Green,Still crazy after all these years!
76' 250 MC5 (orginal owner)
74'250 hare scrambler (project)
74' 1/2 440 maico
78' 440 maico
72' cr125 Husky (project)
93' RMx 250 suzuki
I'll admit - this development has been quite a bummer in terms of the doctor saying... well... you have to be real careful to not sustain injuries at this time. I know it sounds dumb, but I am going to ride - and thankfully... I suppose at my age... well..I really don't have to worry about any "high-speed" crashes... in fact it has been so long since I really crashed...I personally worry more about falling off a ladder than I do crashing in the woods. But... there still exists the possibility of taking a fall and bleeding internally. However, maybe one possibility is that the cardio doctor is offering the direction of having the surgury to close the PFO - and I would have the good possibility to discontinue the warfarin and only taking aspirin to help with clot prevention. I am strongly leaning in that direction of the surgury. As far as cuts, scrapes, etc..which I do seem to get a lot ... there are several products available that you can carry that stops the bleeding - one is QuikClot Powder. The aneursym will have to be one of those things that I will have to deal with eventually. @ Thom Green - as to your friend ...I understand his thoughts... and my wife said... if I had to quit riding..that would kill me faster than any darn crash and injury.
"fasmith" tho I do-not have a hole in my heart, there is a giant message,"if I had to quit riding..that would kill me faster than any darn crash and injury". I look forward to Tulsa 2012, a place , where "dreams" come true...
wayfarin stranger, on a "Penton" ,still the very best
embers, still there!!!!!
Tom Brosius
Mile High Pentons
Anytime, Freddie. That's my cell number.
I'm 73 and have been taking warfarin for 7 years now since my 5-bypass surgery. I also have a Pacemaker. Although I don't ride or race off-road, I still manage to put a few thousand miles on my four motorcycles, two of which are sidecar outfits. ('02 KTM Duke/Velorex & '71 BSA B60/Squire). All my doctors know I still ride, and say "Be Careful!" Some of them ride also, including the head of thoracic surgery at the Cleveland Clinic, who operated on me. I'm going to continue to ride as long as I can, and my wife often acts as ballast. Motorcycles have always been a big part of my life where I have met all my best and oldest friends. Even with all your above listed concerns, which I share, you have to live your own life, and do what you've always done if it makes you happy. Ride your own ride! Good Luck![8D]
I had a visit with the cardiologist today - basically after 3 months on warfarin and a couple of different tests (one being a treadmill stress test while wearing this gizmo thing and another TEE - the doctor says the PFO (the hole in the wall between the right and left atria of my heart) needs to be closed - it's "nice sized" (he spoke of size in a term I did not understand - but he translated it to being "nice sized") and the other factor being the atrial septal anuerysm that is there also. Keeping my blood pressure low along with the warfarin is ok... but he is worried about me buying the farm ...so to speak...especially when I announced - with the support of my lovely wife of 34 years - that I intended to continue riding off road regardless of this .. inconvience. Needless to say..the good doctor just rolled his eyes and mumbled something about "damn crazy dirt bikers". The other story here is there only one doctor in the whole state of South "By Gawd" Carolina who can perform this PFO closure surgery and I have to get in line now to get it done this summer. I also want to say thanks for the replies. In the end - I have oufitted my fanny pack with a QuikClot bandage package. I did have a very profuse nose bleed last Wednesday evening....and after bleeding about a half of a red solo cup of blood - (yes I caught it in the cup to see how much I was losing) we took off for the local urgent care facility to get the bleeding stopped. Funny moment was when the doctor who was packing my nose with cotton asked... how did it start? I said... pointing to my wife ...."I thought she said stand up when she really said shut up...and here we are." The doctor and nurse...turned ever so slowly to look at my wife...who is all of 108 pounds and is giving me this menancing look for no particular reason... other than she might have seen me trying to catch a glimpse down the pretty nurse's top. Needless to say ..it took a few minutes of uncomfortable silence before I realized that they were taking me serious and I had to explain the entire situation...blood thinner...etc. It was kind of funny at first.... at least I thought it was.
In the meantime.... for the next (roughly) six weekends - we are working on laying out the trail for the Sandlapper National Enduro on March 4th. Good thing out of all this...I am not allowed near a machete to whack vines, trees, etc.... but am allowed to work a staple gun to put up arrows. I don't mind that.
Freddie Smith
Some doctors have no sense of humor. [:o)]
Lew Mayer
Freddie, your right that is funny. I told my doctor that I still rode dirt bikes and at first he did not like it much but then decided that it was better than sitting on a couch waiting for a Heart attack to form.. I didn't have the heart to tell him I still race Motocross even at 60 years old. Thankfully I do not have to take any blood thining stuff but you never know what the future holds. This is a good heads up to try and eat right and keep active. I will let my friend know what you guys have said.. I saw him the other day but have not asked him how he is doing with his Medicine. My wife says that me riding is as close to a need in my life as most anything and having to give that up would nearly kill me. frankly I think I take more of a risk climbing a step ladder than riding my bikes.. I knew some one that died as a result of falling off a step stool.. got to watch that stuff, those things are dangerous.:D
Thom Green,Still crazy after all these years!
76' 250 MC5 (orginal owner)
74'250 hare scrambler (project)
74' 1/2 440 maico
78' 440 maico
72' cr125 Husky (project)
93' RMx 250 suzuki
Freddie, don't give up. One of the pro ISDE riders had a similar thing happen a couple years ago, in January. Had the heart surgery a few weeks later and still road the ISDE in Mexico for the US Team, and finished well. I was told by my cardiologist not to ride ever again, but he misdiagnosed me. I take over the counter omeprozole (prilosec)and it caused a condition called hypomagnesemia. This causes cardia arythmias and PVCs. After tons of tests, he said I had a electrical problem with my heart and it would just stop one day and not to put any stress on it, "No riding". FORGET THAT. I did my own research and discovered several research articles on cardiac electrical problems and found research the PPIs (like Prilosec) cause PVCs. You would think the cardiologist would know this. I supplemented my diet with extra magnesium and low-and-behold, problem solve. I councel all my patients now on the possible side affects of PPIs. I have found 5 people with cardiac conditions related to PPIs over the past year that their PCP or cardiologist misdiagnosed. Follow the doctors recommendations, but make sure you get accurate information and make an educated decision on any health care issue.
Lloyd Boland
Lloyd,
Was the extra Magnesium to replace the Prilosec, or to neutralize the effect of it causing cardia arythmias and PVCs? Mike
Michael R. Winter
I enjoy rebuilding and appreciating Pentons!
1974 250 HS Pentons-1980 KTM 175-400'S
1975 Can Am 175 TNT & 77 250 Black Widow
1979 Husqvarna OR390
1976-78 RM & 77-79 PE Suzuki's
1974 CR250M 07 CR125R 79 CR250R
Lloyd -
I am not giving up riding. Right now.. these days.. I feel good - the blood thinner - as other have said... does make you bleed a lot more and I tend to bruise more. This past weekend I had planned to help with working on the trail for our club's national enduro we are hosting in March... I was a little hesitant about riding.. but I said... man... I'll just make sure I wear my flak jacket, pants, boots and anything other protective gear I can put on... just in case. And you know happened? Early Saturday morning as I walked across the wood deck out of the house to go to the shop to load up the bikes... I slipped on the wet wood (it rained all night) and twisted my right knee and banged it hard on the deck which just so happens to have been repaired ten years ago (I tore all the ligaments along with fracturing the shin) and that sucker swelled up in ten minutes and hurt like a sonuvagun. Ticked me off. I was ticked off that I hurt myself worse walking and slipping than if I had hit a darn tree on my bike. As I hopped back into the house....I made a mental note... put on riding gear before even walking out the house. The swelling has finally gone down as of today... it is sore but functional. Turned all kind of colors... blue, yellow, red.... guess the bruising was due to the blood thinner.
I'm riding this weekend. And any other time that I can also. Come hell or high water. Besides.... sand is soft. We don't have rocks here in sandland in SC..... Do have to watch out for those darn wet wooden decks.
I do appreciate you guys replying back. All the positive stuff makes me realize that this issue is not a reason to quit doing what I really love doing --> riding off-road.
Quotequote:Originally posted by Lloyd Boland
Freddie, don't give up. One of the pro ISDE riders had a similar thing happen a couple years ago, in January. Had the heart surgery a few weeks later and still road the ISDE in Mexico for the US Team, and finished well. I was told by my cardiologist not to ride ever again, but he misdiagnosed me. I take over the counter omeprozole (prilosec)and it caused a condition called hypomagnesemia. This causes cardia arythmias and PVCs. After tons of tests, he said I had a electrical problem with my heart and it would just stop one day and not to put any stress on it, "No riding". FORGET THAT. I did my own research and discovered several research articles on cardiac electrical problems and found research the PPIs (like Prilosec) cause PVCs. You would think the cardiologist would know this. I supplemented my diet with extra magnesium and low-and-behold, problem solve. I councel all my patients now on the possible side affects of PPIs. I have found 5 people with cardiac conditions related to PPIs over the past year that their PCP or cardiologist misdiagnosed. Follow the doctors recommendations, but make sure you get accurate information and make an educated decision on any health care issue.
Lloyd Boland
Mike,
PPI (proton pump inhibitors) like Prilosec can cause the kidneys to excrete extra magnesium. This causes a depletion of the magnesium blood levels (hypomagnesemia). The lowered levels of magnesium cause a variety of problems, one of them being cardia arythmias in some individuals. If you take a PPI, you should have your blood blood tested yearly for magnesium levels, it is not a routine test and you need to make sure you request this special test from your M.D. In my experience, many M.D.s do not even know this is a problem yet. The magnesium supplementation is to replace the lost magensium filtered out by the kidneys.
Freddie,
The extra swelling is due to the blood thinners, and the reason most of the time while on blood thinners the recommendation is to not do things that are of a high risk due to prolonged bleeding.
Lloyd
Well it has been approximately two months since I started back riding off road again - with this blood thinner in me -and the other issues I have - and so here is an update. I am still alive and well and riding my butt off. It's been an adventure. Four weekends in the woods - and I collected a multitude of bruises, cuts, scrapes, and other odd and end "what the h*ll did I do get a bruise there" items. So let's see.... one major bruise - whacked my shoulder on a tree and it looked like I had been run over by a car. All kind of colors. Smaller bruises... looked like someone whacked me with a whiffle bat - made of very heavy plastic. Went over the bars once - bit my tongue then - I hit a pine lighter stump hidden in a bunch of pine straw. So first of last week ..cause truthfully I was hurting - I limped around and had to open the refrigerator door with my teeth cause my shoulder hurt so badly and the fingers on my other hand were beat up too...I made a trip to my family doctor - who took one look and said "dear Lord.... why?" and I said ..I am a grown man and I love to ride to dirt bikes. If you want to play - sometimes you gotta pay. So.. the good doctor signed deeply and wrote me a prescription for a huge round of steroids to speed up the healing. And a bottle of painkillers ..which I did not actually need... Now I have taken the steriods before - to speed up the healing process and it was no suprise to me that after starting taking them on Wednesday - by Saturday...not only was I opening the frig door by myself - I could eat food again other than ice cream, mashed potatoes and grits as my tongue had actually healed and the swelling was gone in it too. I also had an additional nuclear stress test at the cardio doctor office again - and my PRO closure is scehduled for mid June of this year. The results of the test were good -- I guess if you can call seeing the PFO open and flap and the aneurysm flopping back and forth like a broken rear brake stay rod on a 1980 KTM - a good result .. well it was wild to see the video myself later in the doctors office. Of course he asked if I had been taking it easy... and of course..I said no... and he said.. he knew it...he had seen my shoulder when I was getting the electrodes stuck on. He is a good doctor however. He just shook his head. I figure... you know... I gotta ride. On the other side of the tracks... I did buy this piece of protective gear ... a EVS Revolt Roost jersey.... actually it is a under the jersey/flak jacket garmet that has foam padding that covers up the chest and also the stomach area - lower than the bottom of the flak jacket.
So... all in all... I am ok..and riding in the woods - we have been working on the trail for the national enduro on March 4th and I can promise you that I was a little scared at first... but after I hit that first tree - all the fear went away. I said.. you know ..I can do this. and I have been much better off in my mind since I have decided to ride. I am not grumpy at home... which my wife says is good cause she was ready to shoot me when I was not riding.
Freddie,
Good to hear your are riding again. Also glad to hear of the pending surgery to repair the septal defect. You have clearly documented the risks though. May I make a suggestion until the surgery, ride cautiously and just have a little fun, not too much, but just enough to keep your sanity so that there are not unforseen accidents that may delay or cancel the surgery. You want to make it to the surgery date, so that you can go WFO afterwords. I say this only being concerned about the risks and the potential for future good outcomes. Good luck and keep us posted.
Lloyd
Quotequote:Originally posted by Lloyd Boland
Freddie,
Good to hear your are riding again. Also glad to hear of the pending surgery to repair the septal defect. You have clearly documented the risks though. May I make a suggestion until the surgery, ride cautiously and just have a little fun, not too much, but just enough to keep your sanity so that there are not unforseen accidents that may delay or cancel the surgery. You want to make it to the surgery date, so that you can go WFO afterwords. I say this only being concerned about the risks and the potential for future good outcomes. Good luck and keep us posted.
Lloyd
Lloyd - I value your advice and I promise I will take it a little more easier as I venture out to ride again. You are right - no need to tempt fate - or to do more damage than necessary at this point. I suppose my mindset was and is - to not let the issues and the warfarin control me as to deprive me of what I truly love to do. I was about to bust wide open to get back riding off-road. The way I looked at it.. I needed to ride to see if I had a "fear" and I can say now I don't. I do realize that a mishap could cause some damage - but what I figured out for me - was that - as in the case of the over the bars adventure..I jumped up and realized..Hey! I'm good! and actually was pretty darn relieved to have done it and not found myself frightened at the possibility of being hurt. Of course - wearing all my protective gear and a little extra stuff... also helped. It was like the time after I suffered an open tibia plateau fracture and tearing four of the ligaments in my right knee after a ugly high-side. I rode a Honda CR500 at the time - and I was terrified of cranking that bike a year later after the injury had healed. I just knew my knee would not hold up to the tremendous pressure you have have to exert on the CR500's kickstarter to boot that bike alive. However... one day..I said I gotta try...and this was after 18 months of rehab and PT - I got on the bike and with much dreaded anticipation..... I said here we go. Let's see what happens. And you know what. Nothing happened... not to my knee. It took me several hard kicks to get it to crank, but my knee did not buckle or explode. I was like.. well ..I'll be doggone. I had been riding a CR250 and my KTMs - but had stayed away from open bikes..simply cause I thought I would not be able to crank them without hurting the knee and the bones that got broke. The worst one to heal was the tendon that tore away from the patella. It took a long time for it to heal after the surgery.
So... yes..I am taking your advice...going to ride ..but with the thing in mind to ride comfortable within reason... as truly I am not a fast rider by any means... and just enjoy the off-road riding in a more reserve manner so that come June - get that sucker repaired and get off the warfarin and then bring myself back to a normal riding speed for me.
I think that taking the blood thinner does not mean you have to stop doing the things you love to do - such as riding off-road but I just know that I need to be aware that I need to cover all the bases so to speak to minimize the injuries that can occur. Ironically - I have not taken a ride on my street bike yet.
Hi Fred
Sorry I've come in on this late. I had 2 heart valves replaced in 1999 and have been on warfararin since. As a youngster I rode MX and I always have had motorbikes. I started riding vintage off-road in 2003 and have ridden vintage Motocross and Enduros since then with the most riding taking place in 2008-2010. during this period, I was also able to get a competition licence despite my condition (with support from my cardiologist). I have been fortunate enough to ride 6 ISDT Reunion rides since 2003. I have had a couple of big get-offs over these last years and the bruising has got to be seen to be believed. The biggest drawback of big bruising like that is deep hematomas which tend to leave lumps below your muscles, which take a loong time to go away.
The simple rules are to ride within your physical and fear limits and wear every bit of protective gear you can get hold of.
Unfortunately, I got an infection on my heart valves this year (from my teeth, not riding!)and I'm typing this from my hospital bed - they replaced the valves again! I can't say If I'll be riding soon but I'm full of hope!
Regards
David Haines
Johannesburg, South Africa
Regards
David
'75 KTM GS250
'75 KTM GS400
Hi Fred
Sorry I've come in on this late. I had 2 heart valves replaced in 1999 and have been on warfararin since. As a youngster I rode MX and I always have had motorbikes. I started riding vintage off-road in 2003 and have ridden vintage Motocross and Enduros since then with the most riding taking place in 2008-2010. during this period, I was also able to get a competition licence despite my condition (with support from my cardiologist). I have been fortunate enough to ride 6 ISDT Reunion rides since 2003. I have had a couple of big get-offs over these last years and the bruising has got to be seen to be believed. The biggest drawback of big bruising like that is deep hematomas which tend to leave lumps below your muscles, which take a loong time to go away.
The simple rules are to ride within your physical and fear limits and wear every bit of protective gear you can get hold of.
Unfortunately, I got an infection on my heart valves this year (from my teeth, not riding!)and I'm typing this from my hospital bed - they replaced the valves again! I can't say If I'll be riding soon but I'm full of hope!
Regards
David Haines
Johannesburg, South Africa
Regards
David
'75 KTM GS250
'75 KTM GS400