I was talking with a member a few nights ago that said some of the other members here might get upset if we sway too far to the side of the Penton bikes on this site.
All of our Pentons were produced by the KTM factory in Austria (*), and I can say personally that I have interest in knowing about all the bikes that came from that factory and the same people that made our Pentons. To me it's interesting because they are all related in some respect, just like your post-vintage KTM's from '78 on...
I have no knowledge of this, but I'm going to guess at this point that the bikes labeled "Comets" were sort of another brand name made by KTM, not a model name.
My lame reasoning is this: Even though they had the "KTM" logo on the tank, the bikes called "Comets" came in different sizes (50's thru 125's), most were little street bikes (they call them scooters over there), but a few were competition Enduro bikes like the one pictured on the Home Page.
Here's a 1970 KTM Comet 50cc Super 4.
http://www.moped-museum.de/ktm/ktm-comet-50s-1970.htm
I've seen some other pictures of this model and parts of the frame are exactly like parts of our Steel Tankers frames.
I'm mostly babbling here looking for answers, please set me straight.
Q:Do you care?
Because Bill Smith has more very cool old pictures available to share.
Thanks, Bob
(*)except the Hiro's and KR Short Trackers.
Rob W,
I like you are interested in everything history wise of KTM. I was especially interested in Dane sharing with us his Summer that he worked at the factory.
Just to have a little fun...........(*).
(*)....and the Mud Lark[8D]. Isn't it great to have the site up and running again.
Ron Carbaugh
Bob,
The POG has set a time frame of greatest interest from the creation of the first Penton till the end of what we refer to as the transition period from Penton to KTM and have established 1988 as that time using technical changes as the deciding factor. This time frame is stated in our mission statement at the top of page 2 of the newsletter for all to see.
The POG also has a great interest in the machines that KTM built prior to the Penton era as these machines show an interesting evolution of ideas and components some of which were incorporated into the Penton.
We have also had discussions on this message board concerning how many POGGERS ride modern KTM machines and which ones they prefer so I guess there is quite a bit of room for discussion.
Paul
I definitely believe that we need to know as much about the pre-Penton era that we can learn. As Paul stated, this provides us with a window to the past and explanations as to where the Penton's came from. If you will look closely at this month's home page picture, you will notice, that the frame on Sigi's 50, looks remarkably like the CMF frames, that didn't come into existance until mid to late 1971. I have a pretty good idea, based on Uncle John's information, as to why, but I'll keep that to myself, until the Steel Tank book happens.
Dane
The pre-Penton KTM history is intriguing and worth digging into I think. I had always heard that KTM made motorcycles back in the post-war days, but was just manufacturing mopeds in the early 60s.
But per the KTM History website http://www.ktm.at/EN/Template_5713.asp?id_seiten=5713 ....
1966 - 1967
Production of the 10,000th Comet moped. KTM wins three gold medals at the international Six Days in Sweden.
Three KTM gold medals in Sweden in '66?? JP was there on BMW, Ekins on Husky, Steve McQueen was there? Were these hopped-up Comet mopeds in the 50cc class, or some other KTM bike incarnation? Hmmmm...
I wish I had seen this photo of the Comet about 6 months ago. After very close examination of this bike, it looks like I had the frame, forks and wheels to it's big brother that took the 100 / 125 engine. We could never figure out what it was. I knew that the 125 Sachs engine fit perfect, but nothing else looked like anything I had ever seen. Sent the photo around to some of my friends and no one else knew what it was, so I sold the roller for $100.00. Now I wish I had it back.
Sooooooooo, all the information we can obtain on the development of these bikes might be greatly helpful to someone.
Donny Smith
I came across this picture about a year ago and was intrigued by it because I thought maybe it was the root of the Alouette Motorcycle . The picture states that it from early 72 but I contacted Leo Keller about it and he advises that this bike was bascically a 1 of prototype built for the ISDT in the mid 60's ... the KTM Comet series were Mopeds and steet bikes . If I find his post I will repost it ... BT
Brian Taylor
Our cool "roots"...
(http://www.pentonusa.org/forum_images/misc/coolroots.jpg) (http://www.pentonusa.org/forum/)
I'm glad there's interest in keeping this rolling, thanks everyone. I was looking at the bike on the Home Page for days, and no one was mentioning a word about it. Now that I've got into this, I'm discovering a deeper history about KTM than I had ever seen before.
Here's more stuff to check out.
#1. http://www.radmuseum.at/unterseiten/ktm_sonder.htm
#2. http://www.ktm.at/EN/chronik_5490.asp?id_seiten=5490
#3. http://www.scootergalleri.dk/html/gal_visbil.asp?ID=38669
#4. http://vi01n116.members.eunet.at/Krackowizer/Krackowizer_Motorcycles_H_L.htm
Rob,
Very noticeable is the frame resemblance to the Steel Tanker Frame on this site: http://www.scootergalleri.dk/html/gal_visbil.asp?ID=38669
Donny Smith
Hi Donny, Yeah it is, it's the same design. That bike was also build at the same time as the KTM/Pentons, so I can understand them sharing the same method of constuction. You can notice parts of the design in the two different bikes over-lapped.
Remember the "V" story from Dane, KTM considered all the KTM/Pentons from 68 thru 71 as proto-types.
Here is the post from Leo Keller who wrote the book on KTM
Brian,
although I wrote that KTM book, I'm not an expert on 50 cc KTM, because they
never built those tiddlers for sale. All the 50 cc were factory bikes, so
the Comet (Comet was the name for all the street bikes from mid of the 60es
till mid of the 80es, I'm not sure if the GS was called Comet).
Enclosed you will find the photos of the 72 Comet Cross (with Puch motor)
and the 65 Comet street bike with Sachs motor.
Gruss:
Leo
Brian Taylor
In the picture that Bill posted of the three KTM racing machines, I recognize the guy sitting on the middle machine and the guy standing on the far right. I can't remember either of their names, but the guy standing on the right, was the support truck driver all the years I went to the ISDT.
Dane
Dane, the 3 riders in that picture are:
Left- Erwin Lechner
Center- Johann Sommerauer
Right- Albert Braun
:D
I don't know who the man standing on the far right is.
Bob W
Bob,
I didn't know that Erwin had ridden the ISDT. I knew that he was a roadracer, but that generally eliminates the dirt. He finished his career at KTM as a sales rep. Sommerauer was still riding the ISDT when I started in '71.
Dane
Quotequote:Originally posted by rob w
I was talking with a member a few nights ago that said some of the other members here might get upset if we sway too far to the side of the Penton bikes on this site.
All of our Pentons were produced by the KTM factory in Austria (*), and I can say personally that I have interest in knowing about all the bikes that came from that factory and the same people that made our Pentons. To me it's interesting because they are all related in some respect, just like your post-vintage KTM's from '78 on...
I have no knowledge of this, but I'm going to guess at this point that the bikes labeled "Comets" were sort of another brand name made by KTM, not a model name.
My lame reasoning is this: Even though they had the "KTM" logo on the tank, the bikes called "Comets" came in different sizes (50's thru 125's), most were little street bikes (they call them scooters over there), but a few were competition Enduro bikes like the one pictured on the Home Page.
Here's a 1970 KTM Comet 50cc Super 4.
http://www.moped-museum.de/ktm/ktm-comet-50s-1970.htm
I've seen some other pictures of this model and parts of the frame are exactly like parts of our Steel Tankers frames.
I'm mostly babbling here looking for answers, please set me straight.
Q:Do you care?
Because Bill Smith has more very cool old pictures available to share.
Thanks, Bob
(*)except the Hiro's and KR Short Trackers.
:)Hallo Bob, If you are interested on KTM Comet 50cc you can take a look to my Homepage http://members.aon.at/fhaglei1/page_1_2.html
greetings from Hallein/ Austria - Fritz
Fritz Hagleitner
Hi Fritz,
Very interesting site with a lot of photos! The air box on the Super Comet looks similar to the early 1968 Penton air box. Any other photos of older Comets?
Jeff Borer
Amherst, Ohio
POGGERS look at photo "KTM Penton?" under KTM mit Sachs Motoren
Hallo Jeff, I have pictures from the older KTM 50 Comet from a prospect. But I dont know how to put it in here?
Fritz Hagleitner
Greetings Austria, Hello Fritz.
Thanks very much for that website. I looked at every single picture on it.
I had no idea there were that many different models, both Puch and Sachs. Very cool to see.
I like ->
http://members.aon.at/fhaglei1/page_4_14.html
Thanks again Fritz, nice to hear from you.
Bob
Hi Fritz,
There are a couple of ways, the easiest is to send them to ADMIN, and they can insert them for you. I'm not sure how to do it the other way. A little help somebody?!
Thanks, Jeff
Amherst, Ohio
These pictures are from ktmfritz:
(http://www.pentonusa.org/forum_images/misc/KTM_Comet_1.jpg) (http://www.pentonusa.org/forum/)
(http://www.pentonusa.org/forum_images/misc/KTM_Comet_2.jpg) (http://www.pentonusa.org/forum/)
(http://i157.photobucket.com/albums/t47/nsujeff/th_HPIM0787.jpg) (http://i157.photobucket.com/albums/t47/nsujeff/HPIM0787.jpg)
(http://i157.photobucket.com/albums/t47/nsujeff/th_HPIM0790.jpg) (http://i157.photobucket.com/albums/t47/nsujeff/HPIM0790.jpg)
//
Hi Fritz,
Thanks for sending the airbox photo. Here is an early '68 Penton airbox with many similarities! It seems to me an industrious person could modify the Comet 'box into a Penton one quite easily if they are available.
I think I figured out the photo posting.
Jeff Borer
Amherst, Ohio