February 2006 Home Page Photo

[Rain Man]

It can be the 175 bike designed by Alois  Marowetz, that one said KTM on the side covers.  Was it Burlesons and Larsons prototype used in September 1971 on the Isle of Mann, where John intorduced the first 175 Jackpiner prototypes.

Raymond
 Down East Pentons

[TGTech]

The bikes that were used on the Isle of Man in the fall of 71, were light blue, like the production versions of the Jackpiners. And they had black engines too.

Dane

[gthong]

WAG here.. brake pedal runs under the footpeg instead of over...

as you can tell... I have little to add

[rpage11]

I tried to blow up the engine case but it gets pretty fuzzy.  It almost looks like Penton written above the oval that usually has KTM.

There's a jackpiner at the bottom of the second page of the '70's KTM webpage.
 
http://web.tiscali.it/ktm70pages/ann68-73.htm

There's a number of similarities.

Skip

[Gary Roach]

I remember Jack Penton telling me one time that KTM's first motor they built was a 388cc. Could this be that motor?

[TGTech]

The  388  had a head that looked similar to one of the old "flat head" Maico's. I'm still trying to get hold of a picture of a bike that I think is one of those machines.

Dane

[OUCWBOY]

Hard to tell for sure, but the swing arm looks like a late model Steel Tank Swing Arm??

Donny Smith

[TGTech]

You guys have been wracking your brains long enough, so I'll fill in the blanks.

This machine is THE prototype of the production Jackpiner. I can't remember the exact time frame in which it was built, but it WAS after the "Puchton" that Kip has recreated. I'm pretty sure that it was either in late 70 or early 71, because as noted earlier, that there were machines that Dick Burleseon and Lars Larson rode at the ISDT at the Isle of Man in the fall of 71.

I believe that KTM was working on their own engines at the point that the Puchton was built, or at least had some idea of where they were going to go. During a conversation that I had with a good friend who still works for KTM, I learned that during the development of the engines, the Penton name had been cast into the engine cases. I had completely forgotten this, but in this picture, you can see the name over the KTM name on the clutch cover.

This machine came to the states for evaluation and was ridden for a while until the production machines started to filter in. It languished in the corner here for a while and then was put in the vestibule at Penton Imports in Lorain for a while before going back to Austria. Once it left here, I didn't really know much about what became of it.

Today, the bike resides in Bergamo, Italy, at the home of Arnaldo Farioli, the former Italian KTM distributor. I have been trying to get a picture of the bike for over a year now, and just before the POG meeting at the AMA, I was sent this lone picture. I am still working on taking some more, but at this point, this is all we have.

I don't know why the lever type cap went away between the prototype and the production machines, but I'm going to speculate that it had something to do with cost.

The frame bracing issue had to have come into play after the machines were being used for more motocross competition, because I'm pretty sure that woods riding wouldn't have stressed the frame to the point where it needed the bracing.

Another thing that I don't remember in the time frame, was when exactly the CMF machines began to be produced, but I'm pretty sure that this machine was the first of them that we saw.

Dane

[rfpotter]

Very enjoyable topic. The twists and turns of the development cycle are amazing to follow. Thanks Dane and others!
(Chakka, did you know the picture was taken in Italy?)

Patrick Houston

[Chakka]

I had a hunch, I think I saw the picture before on an Italian web site and the image stuck in my head. I guess my memory is still semi intact!

Chakka

[Rain Man]

thanks for sharing that bit of JackPiner History with us Dane. I cant help but notice that plenty of us Poggers love this particular model.
 Now I can sleep all day not wondering what the answer was [8D]

Raymond
 Down East Pentons

[TGTech]

I just got some more pictures today, and as soon as I can get them to Bill, I'm sure he'll get one posted.

Dane

[BrianTaylor]

Dane do you know why the colour change of the tank .. that dark blue really looks sharp .. BT

Brian Taylor

[TGTech]

Brian,

   Unlike the production versions of the machines, this tank was painted, where the production versions were gelcoat. That made them much more durable. The blue paint that they used on this machine, was a metallic color just like all the steel tankers prior to the CMFs.

Dane

[rob w]

Dane,
Thank you, you are simply our greatest asset of past and present knowledge circumferencing historical and technical information, that we as Penton owner's have. You are always a strong and true link to our questions/answers of the past. Your first-hand experiences on the topics goes without saying, you were there, and we could'nt find a greater account than your's to help us fill in the blanks. I am very grateful that we have the opportunity to discover and learn from you.
Thanks,
Bob W


This topic: The one and only Non-KTM branded Jackpiner
I like the light blue better :-)