ahrma rules /sachs 6D engine

[Knute]

OK, here's the current status of the Sachs D engine.  Matt Hilgenberg, who is the chairman of the AHRMA Vintage Motocross Rules & Eligibility Committee, was kind enough to call me, Dirk Williams, and Terry Gates today to discuss the eligibility of the Sachs D in Classic 125.  

Basically, Matt said that the rules written years ago were an attempt to accommodate the appropriate Classic era bikes that, of course, existed prior to 1974...such as the Sachs B Penton. Matt and I agreed that I would submit documentation that Sachs B and D engines, except for porting and the bolt on intake manifold, were the same engine. From my conversation with Matt, I believe that he and the other members of the Vintage Motocross Rules & Eligibility Committee are very open to formally allowing the Sachs D in Classic 125, it's just up to us to provide the proper documentation.

So, for now, Dirk will go forward with documentation on his end (Monark, etc.) and I will go forward with documentation from the Penton perspective.  

Doug, you are the man when it comes to the Sachs engines, so your perspective will be very important to our case.  I will contact you in the next week or so.  Actually, if you're going to be at the next POG meeting maybe I should just come up and discuss the issue with you and everyone else and that way we will all be on the same page.

Ron, Thanks for your input.  Actually, carb size is limited to 32mm in Classic 125 so carburetion isn't really a factor.  AHRMA is just under the impression that the D is significantly better than the B.  In my conversation with Matt, he is very open to the concept of the D being allowed in Classic 125.  He would just like us to document our argument for their review.

Dane and Paul,  You're right...there is no problem.  Unfortunately, AHRMA thinks there is so I'll elaborate a little bit on what we're dealing with. The situation here is that Classic 125 is intended to represent the era of machinery that existed prior to the Japanese invasion in 1973-4.  Common examples include the CZ, Husky, Rickman Zundapp, etc.  Currently AHRMA has "clarified" their rules by saying the Sachs D engine is not eligible for Classic 125 and that it must be run in the Sportsman class against the Elsinores, YZ's, TM's, KX's, and Can-Ams.  This decision is based on a set of rules that was written many years ago, with little knowledge of the D engine.  What we are arguing is that the D is not significantly different than the B, and therefore is not significantly better than the B.  In this case, I don't think it really matters to them when the D became available, just that it is not significantly better or more advanced that the B.  Fortunately, they seem very open to this concept if we can provide adequate documentation.

Thanks guys!
Kent

[Knute]

Jerry,

It looks like we both responded at the same time!  Your assessment of the situation is exactly correct.  Thanks again for alerting us to it and for your continued input.  I am cautiously optimistic that we will be able to straighten this out eventually.

Thanks!
Kent

[firstturn]

Kent,
  Your statement to me....

Ron, Thanks for your input. Actually, carb size is limited to 32mm in Classic 125 so carburetion isn't really a factor. AHRMA is just under the impression that the D is significantly better than the B. In my conversation with Matt, he is very open to the concept of the D being allowed in Classic 125. He would just like us to document our argument for their review

my answer to you is that carburetor size is a issue to the people that are whinning about the D engine.  Although experts in the field that have a flow bench at their disposal can make a 125 flow better with a 28 or 30mm than most can make a 32mm most racers just bolt on the biggest carb that a class alows.  My 2 cents for today and thaks for taking the lead.

Ron Carbaugh

[bentrims]

I like to heed the words of Doug Wilford when he told me "for what small gain the D motor may have in performance you lose in reliability". I think he hit the nail on the head. I cant seem to blow the B motor up.  

Donny's 32 jetting didn't hurt any. After the 1000 mile trip down to Texas it started up the first 1/2 kick. My Yamaha friends were amazed when they saw that.

Why would anyone want to race another brand? :)Go Penton:)
Tom B

[bentrims]

Of course the issue is forwarding the D motor specs before a poor rule is Grandfathered in.

[tlanders]

My letter to the Rules Committee and the National Office:

Hi guys,

I have a Penton 125cc Sachs engined bike that has a "B" engine in it. However, I spent alot of time and money trying to find a "D" cylinder for it primarily because of the convenience of the bolt on intake manifold when you have to change carbs. I say "have to change" carbs because the Bings that come with it wear out very fast and the new Bing replacemsnt cost is prohibitive, so I have been replacing my Bings with Mikunis. The "D" manifold makes it easier to do.

I told Doug Wilford, the U.S. Sachs engine expert, I was looking for a "D" cylinder last year and he told me not to waste my time, that the "D" engine was not much better in performance than a "B" and in fact, he prefers the "B" engine. Against his wishes, I finally found a "D" cylinder and purchased it at too great a cost!!!

I am hoping that you don't change the current rule as I (and many other people also) understand it and make the "D" engine a "sportsman" class engine. It is an out of date "classic " engine and it is not competitve against the CZs, etc., especially because of the endless neutrals transmission. I ride it because I only ride Pentons unless I have to ride something else!!!

Thank you for taking time to consider this,

Teddy Landers 62D