Tires

[wade195]

I just purchased a 1973 and 1974 Six days that are going to require alot of attention. I started looking over my parts and my attention came to the tires. My question is what is eveyone doing for tires? Are you using the new style tires? Or are you all trying to use period correct tires? Thank you all in advance.

Doug Wade
Lavergne Tn

[Dwight Rudder]

I try to stay with period tires myself.  I believe they work best on the older bikes as well as look proper.  Piston port small bores need to spin a bit off the corners to get up into the powerband.  I suggest either 350X18 or 400X18 tires.  On the front you can use a Pirelli MT16 if you want the best or you can use Kenda K257D front tires or Cheng Shin C755 front tire.  All look similar to the old Motocross Enduro Metzeler tire.  I like the Pirelli the best and the Kenda Second best.  I think the C/S looks good but the rubber is too soft and squirrely.
On the rear you can go with the Cheng Shin C755 350X18 which looks pretty good and is similar pattern to the old Metzeler.  The 4.10X18 is too short a tire and about the same width as the 350 so it isn't the same as a 400X18.  I prefer the Cheng Shin C183A tires.  Similar design to the old Barum and is a full profile tire like the oldies. Just enough traction too. It will work well. I use them on all my small bores.  Hodaka, Hercules, DKW, Honda, Kawasaki, Zündapp and Pentons ( 100 & 125 ).  If you prefer a bit larger tire the C183A also comes in a 400X18 which is of the correct size and isn't too aggressive a pattern for the bikes.  You can lower air pressure if you want more traction or up the pressure if you want less.  I suggest no bigger than the 350X18 on 100cc Berkshires, and your choice of the 350X18 or the C183A 400X18 on the 125cc Six-Day .  Oh, On 175cc or bigger Jackpiners or Hare Scramblers, you can use the MT16 400X18 ( now called 110/100X18 ).
Cher'o,
Dwight

Dwight Rudder
7 time ISDT / E medalist
8 time National Enduro Class Champion.

[Larry Perkins]

People PLEASE search the past postings when you have a question as this topic has come up several times as have the ANSWERS or opinions of the members.  It just drives me crazy(not that it takes much)that we discuss the same stuff AGAIN and AGAIN.  Search tires.  Work a bit for an answer don't just first pick brains, PLEASE!  

The synopsis of this debate always spins around whether you want to look the part or get the best traction.  If you are MXing the Dunlop 756 is the weapon of choice for traction on a wide variety of surfaces.  The Cheng Shin looks like an old Metzler but no matter what Dwight believes they pretty much suck on an MX track at speed. Just my opinion and the opinion of the VAST majority of modern MXers.

Larry P

[bentrims]

I aint touchin dis one! Just enjoying having my 6 Days spread across the basement floor and getting ready for a new season. What a great country that we have all these options!

[Rocket]

Depends on what part of the country you are from, upper mid-west with black/loamy/traction type soil, Pirelli MT 44 front, Michelin S-12 in the rear.  JMHO
Rocket

[DKWRACER]

Rod, what about Arkansas RR 07, master?..... grasshopper?(JP175)....

[Dwight Rudder]

quote:Originally posted by Larry Perkins
The synopsis of this debate always spins around whether you want to look the part or get the best traction.  If you are MXing the Dunlop 756 is the weapon of choice for traction on a wide variety of surfaces.  The Cheng Shin looks like an old Metzler but no matter what Dwight believes they pretty much suck on an MX track at speed. Just my opinion and the opinion of the VAST majority of modern MXers.

Larry P

Larry, You miss the point here.  We aren't talking about modern MXers are we ?  I believe I have won several MX events on my Cheng Shin C183 tires.  The idea is to get the right amount of traction, not too much.  If you are racing a modern MX bike then by all means use a modern tire.  But don't knock the old school stuff if you haven't tried it.
Just my opionion here.  So don't shoot me for it.  You can use what you like.  I will use what I like.  I was just pointing out that there is more to my reasoning than just looks. Oh, I use Pirelli MT16s front and rear even on my Modern KTM 525EXC.  Look dated but work much better than most tires out there.
Cher'o,
Dwight

Dwight Rudder
7 time ISDT / E medalist
8 time National Enduro Class Champion.

[desmond197]

Dwight

What type of tires do you use on your Puchs? I know ther may be a clearance problem with these bikes. I still have the 30 year old tires on mine and need some fresh rubber.

[Dwight Rudder]

quote:Originally posted by desmond197

Dwight

What type of tires do you use on your Puchs? I know ther may be a clearance problem with these bikes. I still have the 30 year old tires on mine and need some fresh rubber.

I use the C183A Cheng Shin. This is a Barum copy.  400X18 on the 175 and 350X18 on the 125. The 400X18 is a pretty meaty tire but a tread pattern that leans toward hardpack, so you can get the right wheel spin off the corner. Play with the air pressure to get the most out of this tire. Works pretty darn good on these bikes in my opinion even on grass with the correct air pressure.
Cher'o,
Dwight

Dwight Rudder
7 time ISDT / E medalist
8 time National Enduro Class Champion.

[Larry Perkins]

Dwight,

No disrespect intended but I think you are missing the point.  Traction is a matter of physics.  Physics does not recognize old bikes and new bikes.  It is based on compound and tread pattern. Rod is right in that different terrain demands different tires but never on that short list will any go fast racer in MX old or new have Cheng Shin on their list.  My statement on the 756 Dunlop being the number one weapon of choice for MXers across the country is a true statement.  It is a falacy to believe that old bikes require different tires.  It is just physics!

You say that the Cheng Shins work pretty darn good.  When was the last time you Really railed a motocross track?  Cheng Shins in the real world suck for traction when pushed.  They break loose, wash out, and roll over from weak sidewalls.  They are cheap and look like old tires that were good.  Cheng Shins are not those tires.

The Pirelli MT16 is a good off-road tire and does well in most off-road conditions short of real muddy but it too is not that good of a MX tire.  Is there really ever too much traction?  I rarely say man that tire hooks up too good.  

Of course my MAIN POINT that you did not get is that this gets debated again and again.  I only gave my tire opinion to give everyone a synopsis of this old argument so we would not have to do this AGAIN!  The argument just gets rehashed and I wish people would read about it in the past instead of it getting said again and again.  I respect your opinion and I know you believe what you say I just don't think it is as advanced as tires have become.  We will probably always disagree on this I just don't understand why it has to BORINGLY happen again and again.  Rehash-Rehash!

Larry P

[Rocket]

quote:Originally posted by DKWRACER

Rod, what about Arkansas RR 07, master?..... grasshopper?(JP175)....

I'll be there.
Rod

[wade195]

My apoligys to everyone. I did not intend to upset anyone. I will in the future search archives. It was one of those brain burps. Thank you all for your opinions. You all are held in great respect.

Doug Wade
Lavergne Tn

[cubfan1968]

Doug you have no need to apologize. There are no dumb questions here. Take it from me, I've asked some hum dingers over the past couple of years. I think we realize Penton motorcycles are passion, and anybody that shares this passion is one of us.

So have fun with your Penton, ask as many questions as you want. Use the archives (they help alot) don't be afraid to piggy back someone elses question. But by all means have fun and enjoy.

Rod Whitman
Omaha, Nebraska
1972 Six Day (Rider)
1972 Six Day (Project)

[thrownchain]

A lot of good points, the biggest hurdle is how and where are you going to ride it. If you're racing I'd go with Larry's choices, if you're just chasing rabbits around in the woods, something a little less pricey is fine. If you're going for the "look" then you have to go for the pattern tire. If you're riding alot, you may have to try a couple of tires to see what works best for you. There's alot of variables, so don't be afraid to try a couple different ones on for size. [ just like shoes ].

[Frenfroe]

I'll second the question.....what's best for the RR '07? Is it rocky, soft, hardpack, clay, black & slick, all the above? I hope the soil is better than Park Hills as it'll be my first since 2002 at Park Hills.

Frank