New bike vs. old

[Mike Horton]

I have kinda touched on this topic before, but the time has come to go in one direction or the other. After being away for bikes for 30 years the bug hit me again. I quickly bought a couple of Pentons and started riding and enjoying. Of course I was in the minority since my son and his friends and dads all were on modern bikes . Everyone said I had to get a modern bike which I eventually did (98 KTM 200 EXC). Now after a year I still cannot get used to the high seat height even though I am 6'-2". I've had a few rough "tip overs" when my balance went towards the downhill side.  Granted the bike offers a much better ride etc., but I just feel I am not in control as I do on my Pentons. At 56 years I am not jumping or trying to get ready for a GNCC, I just want to have some fun riding once a month or so.  So do I go back to the Pentons and possiblly upgrade the suspension as possible (works shocks etc.) or do I lower the KTM suspension, seat, subframe etc. or do I continue to try and get used to the high bike ? When I touched on this subject before, some people thought I shouldn't use up the Penton for trail riding. I'm not sure why riding a Penton of the trails once a month is any different then racing them on a vintage mx track at least the same amount of time. Has anyone experienced the same problem or can offer any advice?    Thanks, Mike

[firstturn]

Mike,
  Just find you a really nice 1974 or newer 175 Jackpiner (or KTM).  If you get a '74 be sure it has the long travel  laydown rear suspension and the 35mm front forks (I know they come with this size but you never know when they hve been changed out).  It is a great bike and has plenty of power.  If you can't find a 175 go for a 250 and set the timing back (retarted) so it is easy to start and put a torque pipe on it.  Just my thoughts.

Ron Carbaugh

[Mike Horton]

Ron,
Thanks for the advice. I do have a 75 Jack Piner with the layed down shocks and 35mm forks. It needs some work, but I think what you suggest may be the ticket. It was great to meet you at the Reunion Ride in Mo.

Mike Horton

[firstturn]

Mike,
  Just my thoughts....I would spend the money from the sale of the KTM to do a nice...I mean nice engine job and some great rear shocks.  The front end is an easy rebuild and basically you have a new bike.  I have set a few friends up with this type of bike and they have had a great time and realy enjoy the bike AND they are fast and handle in the woods.

Ron Carbaugh

[DKWRACER]

Mike, you could have the KTM suspension lowered with some top out spacers, I have a 28in.inseam and just had this done to my KDX200, and lowered the bike by approx. 1.75 inches,and has given me a confidence boost. If I could have purchased a KTM 200 EXC, I would have but $'s got in the way. I think I wound up with a reasonable compromise.

Good luck tho!
Tom Brosius

[tmc3c]

Hi Mike,There is another plus to riding vintage and that is meeting new friends!!When I ride here in S.C. you would not belive the people who come around just to look at this old PENTON!!Like my brother Ron says with a few changes you can have a bike that rolls on good also!!



Thomas Carmichael


1970 125 Six Day
1976 250 Hare Scrambler

[DKWRACER]

Penton Pride "in the woods" has always been a part of the equasion.
When in the "ride" What do you expect? Will they ever know, what you ride?
Flash bye, but do "stop".  Tell the story of a Penton......
And if you get to spend the night, in the woods, around a campfire....
A Penton, will always reign in supreme...410 members..
LT

[firstturn]

Way to go Tom....  I actually enjoy the stories when people see one of my Pentons in the woods, on a trailer or at a museum.  It amazes me the people that say they wish they would have just bought a Penton rather than going through 3 or 4 bikes while there buddy was still riding and winning on his Penton.  Not that everyone won on a Penton, but there was/is Pride in ownership.  Thanks Tom for your post.

Ron Carbaugh

[cubfan1968]

Tom,you hit the nail on the head,I like riding the newer bikes but the kick I get from riding the Penton in the woods is beyond compare.

A couple of months ago I joined up in the woods with a couple of other riders, one on a WR450 Yamaha the other on a Honda CRF450. Comments were made prior to the ride if I could keep up on a 125. After about 30 minutes of riding we hit a clearing and pulled over for a rest. The 1st comment was, "Wow that thing does pretty good out here". Then I got my opportunity to tell the Penton story.

Go Penton.

Rod Whitman
Omaha, Nebraska
1972 Six Day (Rider)
1972 Six Day (Project)

[Young Ted]

Mike - Here is my side. I rode nothing but DAVIE, my '77 250 GS6, on trail rides and enduros until the summer of '03. At that time I bought an '02 KTM 250 RFS, affectionally known as INCA. Two of my reasons fo this purchase were, the suspension to reduce the wear and tear on the body so I could ride longer in life and the magic button. Falling over for me was not due to the seat height, for DAVIE was actually 3/4 on an inch higher on the garage floor. The higher center of gravity is the culprit. Once you tip so far, forget it, you're going down. When I lowered the suspension 1 inch, it made a difference, and I didn't need all the ground clearance anyway.
     Now I ride DAVIE for special occasions, the Jack Pine Enduro and the Reunion Ride, while INCA in my main bike for trail rides and enduros. I have yet to get it in my head 100%, that when making a turn on INCA, don't slow down or over you go. As I see it, I have the best of both worlds, for my bikes are to be riden and far from show pieces.

Young Ted

[Speedy]

quote:Originally posted by Young Ted

Mike - Here is my side. I rode nothing but DAVIE, my '77 250 GS6, on trail rides and enduros until the summer of '03. At that time I bought an '02 KTM 250 RFS, affectionally known as INCA. Two of my reasons fo this purchase were, the suspension to reduce the wear and tear on the body so I could ride longer in life and the magic button. Falling over for me was not due to the seat height, for DAVIE was actually 3/4 on an inch higher on the garage floor. The higher center of gravity is the culprit. Once you tip so far, forget it, you're going down. When I lowered the suspension 1 inch, it made a difference, and I didn't need all the ground clearance anyway.
     Now I ride DAVIE for special occasions, the Jack Pine Enduro and the Reunion Ride, while INCA in my main bike for trail rides and enduros. I have yet to get it in my head 100%, that when making a turn on INCA, don't slow down or over you go. As I see it, I have the best of both worlds, for my bikes are to be riden and far from show pieces.

Young Ted

You sure have it the right way my friend.
Speedy---->>>>>>

Helmut"Speedy"Clasen
 Ontario Canada
http://speedy_c.tripod.com
http://picasaweb.google.com/vindurospeedy
2 x Sachs MC-GS 250-7A
1 x Hercules 350-7A 77
2 x Hercules 250-7A 76
2 x Hercules 250-7A 77
Zuendapp 125 GS 72-73

[Speedy]

quote:Originally posted by Mike Horton

I have kinda touched on this topic before, but the time has come to go in one direction or the other. After being away for bikes for 30 years the bug hit me again. I quickly bought a couple of Pentons and started riding and enjoying. Of course I was in the minority since my son and his friends and dads all were on modern bikes . Everyone said I had to get a modern bike which I eventually did (98 KTM 200 EXC). Now after a year I still cannot get used to the high seat height even though I am 6'-2". I've had a few rough "tip overs" when my balance went towards the downhill side.  Granted the bike offers a much better ride etc., but I just feel I am not in control as I do on my Pentons. At 56 years I am not jumping or trying to get ready for a GNCC, I just want to have some fun riding once a month or so.  So do I go back to the Pentons and possiblly upgrade the suspension as possible (works shocks etc.) or do I lower the KTM suspension, seat, subframe etc. or do I continue to try and get used to the high bike ? When I touched on this subject before, some people thought I shouldn't use up the Penton for trail riding. I'm not sure why riding a Penton of the trails once a month is any different then racing them on a vintage mx track at least the same amount of time. Has anyone experienced the same problem or can offer any advice?    Thanks, Mike

Mike,...I am riding my 250 SACHS(1967)(and other Herculess bikes from 1976) in modern bikes and class Hare Scrambles and I am not coming in last place.
It is a special challenge which I enjoy very much.People who first looked and smiled(shaked there heads)coming now with there cameras and taking pictures and asking a lot of questins.
Enjoy VINTAGE,..
Speedy------->>>>>>>>>

Helmut"Speedy"Clasen
 Ontario Canada
http://speedy_c.tripod.com
http://picasaweb.google.com/vindurospeedy
2 x Sachs MC-GS 250-7A
1 x Hercules 350-7A 77
2 x Hercules 250-7A 76
2 x Hercules 250-7A 77
Zuendapp 125 GS 72-73

[socalmx]

There is a time and place for everything. I enjoy riding my Penton at a vintage event but also enjoy riding my WR250F everywhere else. Spend the money to get the new bike dialed in.

[tomale]

Mike I have to say that I love my Penton and I have ridden it in the wood on numerous occasions. The problem is like young ted has already said, these wonderful bikes are hard on the body. thus riding a newer bike, I hate it but the older I get the more this is important.

Thom Green,Still crazy after all these years!
76' 250 MC5 (orginal owner)
75' GS400 (project bike)
72'sixday (project bike)

[Mike Stephenson]

I am with Ted on this one - the best of both worlds.  I have yet to do any trail riding on the Penton, but plan to do a fair bit this summer.  Some of the FES enduros with my kids, plus some general trail riding. My 05 KTM 250 will see the vast majority of the miles in various enduros and plenty of trail abuse.  The handful of times I have ridden the Penton here at home, I am always thrilled with the huge grin on my face when I ride - wondering why,  when I am on a bike with 1/2 the suspension and handling etc. it is soooo much fun!  I dont want to give up either.

Lowering the 98 really is not that hard if you dont need to lower it much.  A quick, inexpensive way is to buy a lower seat from some place like Enduro Engineering, then maybe raise the forks in the clamps, and back off rear preload (while that is not ideal from a handling stand point, it can work for light duty use).  Between the three (Seat, raise forks in clamps, back off preload), I would not be suprised you can lower the bike by 1" or maybe more.  Then consider the subframe mod - again EE can do it rather inexpensively - I understand that can yield a decent amount of height reduction.  Oh, one option for the seat is to cut down your current seat foam.  Just a guess, but if you cut down your seat foam yourself, for under $100, you can lower the 98 well over an inch.   The go ahead and spend a few bucks on some improvements for the Penton - gotta give it it's fair share of attention!

Mike Stephenson
Atlanta, Michigan
Penton Newbie - thanks to Young Ted!