AMA VMD vs AHRMA: United we stand, div

[Ernie Phillips]

United we stand, divided we fall.

Pre-entries:  Cross Country / Hare Scrambles
   
2009 VMD      116
2009 Windham  53
2008 VMD/Ahrma  185 (first year)
2007 VMD/Ahrma  no CC

Pre-entries:  Vintage MX

2009 VMD      173
2009 Medina  130
2008 VMD/Ahrma  447
2007 VMD/Ahrma  489

In a heads-up comparison of racer numbers for 2009, AMA beats AHRMA.  However, compared to 2008 & 2007, VMD at Mid-O is pretty weak this year.  Comparing some of the VMD VMX classes 2007 vs 2008 vs 2009 below:

Class: 2007, 2008, 2009

100:  n/a, 26 (first year), 12
125:  62, 51, 20 (all 125s, AMA does not offer Classic)
+50:  93, 70, 26
   
(2007 life was good)
(2008 gasoline was 4 bucks a gallon)
(2009 Obama stimulus package, Rob AMA & Rob Iannucci, AHRMA exec committee)

Just for grins, let's compare VMX at Diamond Don vs VMD (AMA) vs Median (AHRMA)this year (pre-entry):
   
Diamond Don, 264
VMD, 173
Medina 130


A good promoter generates more interest and racer participation than either of the Ohio AMA or AHRMA events.   And when you consider the vintage rider population centers; Ohio vs. Jefferson TX, just goes to show who knows what they are doing.

Looking to the future, the AMA does not give a hoot about Vintage Racing long term.  If the AMA continues to run VMD without AHRMA participation, then as a National racing venue VMD will become more and more a side-show.  Even with the promise of an AMA Grand National Championship award, less than half of 2008 pre-entries bothered to participate. SAD.  Change at AMA and AHRMA is needed, and it is needed now!  (Of course, if somebody could find out what Rob I. really wants ... oh wait, Rob AMA already did and it did not include Vintage Racers)


Ernie P.
Chattanooga, TN

[Dennis Jones]

Stay on the soapbox Ernie, You're doing a good job!

This is the first time in 14 years that I am not already at VMD on a Thursday afternoon. I just couldn't bring myself to do it

Dennis Jones

[brian kirby]

Road Race entries are 40% of last year (or down 60%)
VMX is 38% of last year (or down 62%)
PVMX is 25% of last year (or down 75%)

But on the up side, you get an AMA #1 plate for a race that is smaller than some regionals I've been too so thats nice.

Brian

'72 Berkshire

[chicagojerry]

i'm a little disappointed to see that the numbers of the CC entrants are that much higher for the vmd race than the windham race. jim kuhns, my layout partner, looked at the course at mid-ohio this evening. he thinks that it is about a mile shorter than last year. which would make it about 2.6  miles.  after the effort we put in to the inaugaral race last year, its a bitter pill to swallow to watch someone else put the course together following our main pathways. one of the things that i pride myself in, when laying out a course for the ahrma races, is that i consider the skill level of both the riders and the equipment of bygone years and i try make sure that the novices can have as much fun as the experts.i'm not sure that that same logic applies to someone unfamiliar with the vintage/post-vintage nuances. i hope that all the riders have a good time tommorow and hopefully that more of them will come out for some more ahrma CC's as well. i think that i'm done laying out courses for this year unless i can find a way to get the time to get down to barber to help lamberth out there. between windham and smith road, it was a great weekend. i'll try to look up a lot of you guys up at the POG tent at vmd.  chi jer

[dennis brown]

i was at mid ohio to go to the swap meet, did not ride. the riders i talk to did not like the course much, i was hopeing the numbers would be down,the c.c. at windham was great.but it was on a friday.the numbers are always down for friday races. i know it had to be that way this year. kelly owner of jeep skool would like a 2 day next year in sure the numbers will be a lot higher.is there any one out there that knows of a nice greeves for sale?thanks

dennis l.brown

[Larry Perkins]

The races were great and it will be cool for many like myself to get an AMA number one plate in Vegas at the AMA banquet.  Those that chose not to race in protest only hurt themselves in my opinion.  I went to the AHRMA National the week before and the AMA VMD event and enjoyed both.  Both parties have some good things and a blend would be even better.  I am reminded of Ray Kroc the founder of McDonalds saying-No one of us is as smart as all of us.  VMD was as fun as always and enjoyed seeing all the POG people.  The one observation from racing this event is that AMA has upped the profile of Vintage with the number one plates awarded at the AMA banquet and with the crowning of a Grand National Champion.  I also think it is a plus that some youth racers got to experience Vintage racing.  Just my spin after attending.

Larry P

[baxtermcc]

Jerry,
From the starting line back to the scoring barrels - one lap - 2.5 miles on my trip odometer.

Easily shorter than last year, and thank goodness the rain waited until Saturday.  The course was borderline in a few spots for the vintage classes, and the rain would have made it extremely difficult.

Bob McCullough

[Dwight Rudder]

Sorry, but a Nat'l Championship earned in one race is a Nat'l Championship in name only.  Congrats on your race win as you deserve it, but the AMA is a bit of a joke at this point. Who are they trying to fool ?
IMO,

[Larry Perkins]

Dwight,

Thanks for the Congrats and you are kind even in disagreement as always.   However, many sports have one day National and World Championships and though they are a different format they are just as valuable and cherished.  My World Championship in bicycling was a 30 second race and though it may not seem like a big deal to you I have in my livingroom a Sterling Silver Cup that says I was the first Cruiser World BMX Champion and in the UCI books it says the same.  The Superbowl is one day and it still seems to be a big deal.  None the less of opinions on how much a championship these were it earned a AMA number one plate just like Bubba and others will get in Vegas and it will have our names on them and we will be the first AMA Vintage National Champions.  It has taken this sport to a new level and there were a handful of Factory riders and a couple of Supercross riders there trying to win which is another level of participant also.  I am glad for the changes and sure do dig the cool hat the AMA gave me Saturday that says National Champion on it.  I did not have to wait over a year to get it like my last AHRMA Championship jacket either.  As I said before, though, AMA and AHRMA both have good ideas and a blending of them would be great.  AHRMA did have an emicery there perhaps looking for healing middle ground.  They both are representing the vintage sport now and we should do all we can do to look for its advancement.

Larry P

[G Ellis]

So does that mean when I won a National Enduro Championship for a class,it is in name only? That is only a one day event. I enjoy racing dosen't matter who puts it on. I did notice that pre-enter price was 45.00, post-entery 50.00. If you race Friday or Saturday you could race a second class for 35.00. If you pre-entered for a second day and did not want to race, you received your money back, you wouldn't get it back from AHRMA. I will support both,so I can ride more. Just my two cents  Later Gary

[Dale Fisher]

We attended the flat track racing Friday night.  One of the features was a restored racer of Dick Mann's which lapped the track a couple of times.  The person responsible for the showing and restoration was Robert Iannucci of Team Oboslete who also had displays in a couple of other areas.  He came up to the stage to talk and I was amused when he discussed how he wanted to help grow the sport of vintage racing.  This from the person who has done his best to tear a portion of the sport apart.  I would hope the AMA is not resting it's success on the shoulders of this individual.

[Dwight Rudder]

quote:Originally posted by Dale Fisher

We attended the flat track racing Friday night.  One of the features was a restored racer of Dick Mann's which lapped the track a couple of times.  The person responsible for the showing and restoration was Robert Iannucci of Team Oboslete who also had displays in a couple of other areas.  He came up to the stage to talk and I was amused when he discussed how he wanted to help grow the sport of vintage racing.  This from the person who has done his best to tear a portion of the sport apart.  I would hope the AMA is not resting it's success on the shoulders of this individual.

You know they are.   Sad but true.

[Dwight Rudder]

quote:Originally posted by G Ellis

So does that mean when I won a National Enduro Championship for a class,it is in name only? That is only a one day event.
 Later Gary

Gary,  If you won a Nat'l Enduro Class Championship you had to race more than one event.  Nobody said anything against one day events. But a true nat'l championship is a series of events.  I am proud for Larry as he is a good friend and a great competitor. BUT, it is the AMA who cheapens the # 1  plate by putting it all on one event and calls it THE Nat'l Championship.  Sort of how the AMA selects the ISDE team these days too.  One or two events and they send these riders to the Olympics of Motorcycling.  I remember when the ISDT Qualifier series was 8 events and was more important than the Nat'l Enduros and it was a true championship that actually trained riders for the ISDT.  Do you know of any Nat'l Champions that only have 1 event to attend ?  I am bitching about the AMA and nobody else.
ANYWAY, Congrats again to Larry.

[firstturn]

Dale,
  Great post and I hope a lot of people reading it understand the background of this guy.

"We attended the flat track racing Friday night. One of the features was a restored racer of Dick Mann's which lapped the track a couple of times. The person responsible for the showing and restoration was Robert Iannucci of Team Oboslete who also had displays in a couple of other areas. He came up to the stage to talk and I was amused when he discussed how he wanted to help grow the sport of vintage racing. This from the person who has done his best to tear a portion of the sport apart. I would hope the AMA is not resting it's success on the shoulders of this individual."

Ron Carbaugh

[Ernie Phillips]

Congratulations Larry!  A win is a win.  Wins don't just happen.  It takes skill, determination, strategy, perseverance, preparation and sometimes luck.  In addition to your award, I hope AMA gives you some travel money and treats you like a Champion in Las Vegas.  They should.

Larry wrote:
"Those that chose not to race in protest only hurt themselves in my opinion."

Your right, it did HURT me and many others like me who chose to skip Mid-O this year.  I didn't mind missing the racing because I've had success (and failure) there before.  But it did HURT to miss visiting with POG members, some of whom I've never met in person.  It HURT not to be able to stroll through the swap meet.   It  HURT to miss wishing Happy Birthday to Mr. Penton and Jack.  By choice, I set out this year just like 60% of the other AHRMA racers who disapprove of Mr. Iannucci and Mr. Dingman's actions.  Racing during VMD at Mid-Ohio has always been a side-show.  By comparison, the 2009 AMA Grand National Championship was a small side-show.  Mr. Iannucci's AMA has acted like the eight grade bully on the kindergarten playground.  I'll not be part of it.


Ernie P.
Chattanooga, TN