two wheel tuesday

[tomale]

Did any see the little feature on the ISDT of 73' on bike week, yesterday? I recognized alot of the names. Way to go Carl Cranke and all the guys that that represented us. I am impresssed with your skill's and honored to  get to even talk to such men. LONG LIVE PENTON AND THE MEN AND WOMEN WHO RIDE THEM !
I think that it is time for a woods bike, I have been missing out.
Question, What kind of carb did you use to keep your bikes so that they would start in the first couple of kicks. Could not have been a Bing. Or was it and you worked your magic.

Thom Green,I own and ride a 76 250 MC5 MX which I bought new.

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Speaking of bike week on t.v. last night does anyone have a copy of the tape of the 73 ISDT. Seema to me a long time ago Penton Imports had 8 mm movies of this, how cool would it be to have available foe fellow poggers?

 

[TGTech]

Tom,
All of our bikes used Bing carbs, but we did work on them to make them carburate properly. One thing that KTM always did, was to "ride the dyno" way too much, and never paid much attention to the bottom of the powerband. And if the carb isn't right, then the starting will suffer. If the idle circuit is not set properly, then the bike won't start well, period. Either lean or rich mixtures, will hamper starting. In fact, a lean condition, will automatically convert to a rich situation, because when the engine is lean, and supposed to be accellerating, but doesn't have enough fuel, then it will immediately go rich.

Through one channel or another, we were able to get different slides and needles, along with the idle jets, needle jets, and main jets. By playing with all of the circuits, it is possible, to make a Bing (or even, believe it or not, an Amal) carburet properly. The trick is having the correct parts.

Dane Leimbach

 

[Larry Perkins]

AMAL,AAAAAHHHHHH!

 

[tomale]

Thanks Dane for the reply.
I always have trouble starting my KTM with a Bing when it is cold. It is easier when it is warmer out. After the bike is warmed up It starts just fine, usually on the seconded or third kick. My plugs always are faily black not oily but black. I always figured that this was because of mixed gas. By the way I use and have used golden spectro at 40:1 As for my carb settings I will have to look that up I have kept a record of what changes that I have made, which is not very much. Am I missing something?

Thom Green,I own and ride a 76 250 MC5 MX which I bought new.

[Paul Danik]

Thom,
   I have always had excellent results with the Bing carbs.  The only time I have ever had a problem was when a jet or passage became clogged. The one thing I have always found on a Penton is to flood the engine with the tickler to start a cold engine.  I was on the line at the 1973 ISDT on the first day and was a bit nurvous and did not flood the engine.  I kicked and kicked and was getting a bit excited at the prospect of not starting. One of KTM's men, I believe it was Erwin Lechner, came over and pointed to the tickler, I flooded the carb and my bike fired on the next kick. Actually it is rare to not have a cold Sachs powered machine fire up on the first or second kick, my opinion! I had a 250 MC 5 and I would always make sure that the front wheel was in a hole or at least slightly lower than the rear and then I would tickle the carb till it really flooded, that bike would always fire on the first or second kick, it would start to die and I would hit the tickler again and usually it was fine after that.
Hope this helps.
Paul

 

[tomale]

Dane,
Yes it does and I will try that. but how do you know when the bike is flooding. I wondered about that tickle button and pulled the carb apart to check it out. it seemed to move fine and I adjusted my float to what the manual says is correct. I never could get that thing to flood enough to cause it leak out of the over flow tubes. Maybe they are plugged. Maybe something else is plugged.

I was never an enduro rider and so I never heard much about how we faired in any of the ISDT's but from what I did heard you guys were awsome. Let me extend my congratulations to you for a fine job and showing the world that once again. America can hold it own.
Thanks again for your help

Thom Green,I own and ride a 76 250 MC5 MX which I bought new.

[Paul Danik]

Thom,
   The tickler pushes down on the float and holds it down, allowing fuel to keep running into the carb.  I have seen guys tickle, or keep jiggeling the tickler, that is not of any use.  Just hold down on it and wait, as soon as the float bowl fills up, fuel will start to run out the overflow and will cover the top of the engine cases with expensive fuel/oil mix. If it wants to keep flowing after you let up on the tickler, you can then jiggel the tickler to get the float needle to seat.

Paul

 

[Randy Kirkbride]

Paul,
Back in the 70's, I always had good luck starting year 'round with Bings. I always used the choke for cold starting.  I've bought three bikes in the last year to restore and all had the choke slide removed and either siliconed the cable hole or put a bolt in it.  I can't imagine anyone riding without a choke but evidently some are. Thom, is your choke operating properly?
Randy

 

[Dennis D]

Randy, Are you talking about using the choke and the tickler both or one or the other? Dennis

 

[tomale]

Randy, Dane,
I realize that the tickler is suppost to be held down but even after holding it down for several minutes, there is still no gas from the overflow. As for the choke, my bike never had one. I asked AL B. about getting one for my bike and he said not to bother. when the bike was new I was still living in Calif. and cooler weather was seldom a problem. Before this bike I owned a maico and I have owned Bultaco's and several Montesa's too. I never use to have this much trouble starting my bike.  I had caulked it up to a change in location and weather, still the weather here in the Great Northwest is milder than many places around the  country. The worst day riding is still better than doing yard work.

Thom Green,I own and ride a 76 250 MC5 MX which I bought new.

[Randy Kirkbride]

Dennis,
In cold weather here in Ohio, I would tickle the carb till it overflowed & turn the choke on full if the bike was cold. Once the bike was warmed up, I didn't do either.
Thom,
If your carb doesn't overflow in a few seconds after holding the tickler down, you may have something plugged up.
Randy

 

[Dennis D]

Thom, Next time you have the float bowl off of your carb turn it upside down and push the tickler in and see if it is even hitting the float. I had that problem on my Victor and found the level on the float was to low for the tickler to hit it. Dennis

 

[Dennis D]

I meant when you have the carb off of the bike and the float bowl off.DUH!Dennis

 

[hrbay]

Thom, get it to flood? If not and you have the carb off... place carb mouth on level surface with the float pivot low, the float bottom should be 90 degrees to the flat surface. Use a square or something to check it. There is a tab on the float at the pivot that adjusts it. If it still won't flood the vent which goes thru the bowl may be plugged, chk.with a wire before you install....this is for the 54 & 84 Bings and it may run a little richer. GC

GC